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152276 No.9833   [Delete]   [Edit

Ok /tr/, quick question on proper terminology. I was talking to my gay friend and I brought up the subject of traps (specifically asking if he knew any cute traps) and he starting going off about how that was a derogatory "trans-phobic" word and how the proper term was "trans-gender."

I call bullshit but honestly, I want to know what your guys' opinion is. Do any of you traps here mind being called such IRL or would you prefer the term "trans-gender?"

Delicious Jun is always related.

>> No.9834   [Delete]   [Edit]

Jah, we just call them girly men.

>> No.9840   [Delete]   [Edit]

Tell him that you go to a board for people who like "traps", some of whom identify as "traps", and he's making a big deal out of simple terminology.

>> No.9875   [Delete]   [Edit]
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Crossdresser is more appropiate if they just crossdress or transvestites if they have a fetish for dressing up in femenine clothing.
Transgenders are people who consider themselves female in a male body (and not just males who like to dress like females) so in most cases this won't apply to a trap (except maybe for Jun who does state he considers to be in the wrong body).

Trap describes actually a passive phenomena and not an active one as described above. That means that it's everyone around the person who perceives him (or her in the case of reverse traps) belonging to the opposite sex he/she was born into. So even if that person hasn't actually crossdressed in his life (or at least he doesn't think he has in some border cases where the clothing is pretty androginous) he might still be put in that category.

Let's take the example of Tieria Erde. Before the show was aired (and way before he was canonically sanctioned in the ball episode) people assumed he was going to be the female pilot who was a dyke/tomboy (dressed like a boy but obviously a girl). After the airing a lot of people were heavily surprised to find out he was a boy (and even more to find out he was an android and apparently sexless (and get it topped off finding out that those androids actually had actual sexual organs/genders when Lyle's sweetheart stole the show)).
What does this show us? That one same person, while not being originally crossdresser, transvestite or transgender can generate enough confusion to be considered a trap: that is a person you'd hit on regardless on if you're expecting straight or homosexual sex in an eventual one night stand.

>> No.9876   [Delete]   [Edit]

Transgender: having undergone an operation to alter one's physical gender.

Crossdresser: One who, through application of clothes and/or cosmetics, causes themself to appear as the opposite gender.

Trap: One who could easily pass for the opposite gender regardless of clothing or cosmetics; see: Jun

>> No.9883   [Delete]   [Edit]

"Trap," as near as I can tell, is just internet slang without any particular pejorative sense, excepting the very obvious "oh noes, a man in disguise trying to make me teh gheyzors." As long as you don't have anything against being gay, there really isn't anything in the term to suggest anything bad about the person in question, themselves.

I don't consider transsexuals traps, whether pre- or post-op, though I can see why some people would; and transgendered people can be traps, though it's far from necessary, and the opposite is just as true—traps aren't necessarily transgendered—I have a feeling that most transvestites, whether convincing or not, self-identify as the gender that corresponds to their sex.

>> No.9884   [Delete]   [Edit]

Wrong. I see you've never heard of pre-op and post-op (some decide to stay pre-op because they want to have a mutilated organ).
Transgender don't need necessarily to go through an operation. Also, gender is social not physical. It's how society views you socially (and legally) and how you view yourself. OP's friend has a point saying traps could be considered Transgender but that would imply every Trap also considers themselves female.

Also, Crossdresser also applies to people who unsuccesfully wear clothing of the opposite gender (see joke examples in anime like Kamen No Maid guy or crossdressing episodes from Gintama).

I agree on the trap definition which (albeit incomplete) sums it up pretty well.

>> No.9885   [Delete]   [Edit]

Gender is at least as much a psychological thing as it is sociological. A large part of gender depends on how the person sees themselves. Haruhi (from Ouran), for example, is still entirely female, although virtually her entire school sees her as male.

>> No.9887   [Delete]   [Edit]


Gender 1. The condition of being female or male; sex.
Thanks, dictionary.com

A pre-op transgendered person would be considered a transvestite/crossdresser. Just because you're a woman in your head doesn't mean you aren't a man in bed.

>> No.9890   [Delete]   [Edit]


Actually, psychologists clearly make a difference between "gender" and "sex".

It may sound stupid, though.

>> No.9904   [Delete]   [Edit]



Stopped reading there.
Grab a real dictionary.

I can agree with that.

>> No.9905   [Delete]   [Edit]

Transgender = umbrella term for any gender-variant people (transsexuals, genderqueers, third genders, crossdressers, etc etc). Can also refer to people who question their gender but do not identify with any of the subcategories.

Trap = crossdressers (female impersonators). Can sometimes refer to pre-op transsexuals, but this is a pretty offensive term towards anyone but crossdressers.

Transsexual = people who were born in the wrong body, so to speak (there are pre-op, post-op and non-op transsexuals). This includes transgirls (transwomen) and transguys (transmen), or mtfs (male to females) and ftms (female to males). Transwomen take a cocktail of female hormones and transmen take testosterone supplements.

For instance, Nitori in Hourou Musuko is a transgirl. Despite not being on hormones and being perceived as male in her everyday life, she is still a transgirl. Just because she is not seen as a girl all of the time does not in any way negate the fact that, yes, she sees herself as wanting to have been born female.

This is coming from a real life transwoman, so there you have it.

>> No.9906   [Delete]   [Edit]

Oh, and by the way -- pretty much any of the general slang words for transpeople (trannies, shemales, cuntboys, ladyboys - yes, this includes 'traps') are offensive. Just so you are aware.

>> No.9907   [Delete]   [Edit]

We are.
That's why I only use it for crossdressers.
Remember that this is a board about a certain fetish and that of all the other alternative slang words trap would be the most neutral and at the same time best describing one for the overall fetish (as it not only includes crossdresser but also androginous-looking people in general).

>> No.9908   [Delete]   [Edit]

Yes, I realize. I don't particularly mind it so much, as long as the difference between types of traps is made clear. I was mostly saying that because the OP asked that very question - whether it was offensive or not.

>> No.9916   [Delete]   [Edit]
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Interesting, OP here, thanks for the honest response. Another question if you don't mind that's tangentially related to my original one.

Do trans-gender people (who have not undergone transsexual surgery and do not intend to do so) prefer to be called by the gender they identify with or by their biological sex? I would assume the former since that's the whole point of identifying yourself with a particular gender, but it would be nice to be certain.

Also, assuming you are a female-identifying trans-gender person (that's a mouthful), what kind of person are you attracted to? Are you attracted to manly guys, girly guys, or girls? I know that the vast majority of transvestites are attracted to women (Eddie Izzard's words, not mine) but is the same true of trans-gender people?

Also, why is Aikawa so fucking hot?

>> No.9922   [Delete]   [Edit]

"I can't help it. I was drawn that way"

Not who you're replying to but transvestites /=/ transgender people and you're stating an opinion (even if not your own one), not a fact.

>> No.9924   [Delete]   [Edit]

Consider the gender expression as the sum of three distinct factors:

1) Physical Sex
2) Preferred Partner
3) Self Identity

Physical Sex is set prior to birth and is the most invariant.

The other two, having their source in people's minds,
are far more variable.

Preferred Partner can range from exclusively hetro to
exclusively homo and everywhere in between.

Self Identity can range from completely comfortable with
one's Physical Sex to completely at odds with it.

Transgenders generally have some conflict between their
Physical Sex and their Self Identity but there is a huge
variation in the degree and how it is expressed (or not).

Another important observation is that Self Identity is
completely independent of Preferred Partner.

In other words, regardless of how you Self Identify it
doesn't predict who your Preferred Partner is...

Last edited 09/05/25(Mon)17:09.

>> No.9928   [Delete]   [Edit]

Yes, usually they prefer being referred to with the pronouns of whatever gender they are transitioning to. Not always, but most of the time, and it's always a good idea to ask them how to refer to them.

Haha, you can just say transwoman or mtf. And, like any other group of people, there are straight, bisexual and gay transwomen ('straight' meaning attracted to men, and 'gay' meaning attracted to women). There seems to be a higher percentage of lesbians than general statistics would suggest (i.e. there are 3 in 5 lesbian transwomen instead of 1 in 5, although this is just an estimate) but that could be that the most visible, vocal transwomen just happen to be lesbians. I personally am bisexual who is currently looking for a relationship with a man.

Not true. Transvestites, although not transsexual, are most certainly transgender. The word itself just refers to anyone who is gender-varient in any way, really, and to whoever does not identify as a cisgender (natal, or non-trans) person.

>> No.9934   [Delete]   [Edit]

That's why NEVER bring up fantasy elements into reality. I might fap for Jun, but not for some transvestite shemale shit

>> No.9944   [Delete]   [Edit]

You're mixing up stuff there.
Transvestites are people who have a fetish for crossdressing themselves. Look the word up ethimologically and you'll see it just means "crossdresser" though today it's used as a medical term (and also derogatory in some cases) for someone who has crossdressing fetish.

>> No.10717   [Delete]   [Edit]

Well, from personal experience, I have a friend who came out that he liked men, then shortly thereafter came out that he should have been a woman. So she is now a woman, (in the early stages of transitioning,) has a new, female name, and refers to herself as a she.

To further confuse matters, the man she was dating online turned out to be woman who's a transvestite. She kept up the lie so they wouldn't break up, but they're still dating visiting occasionally.

So I have a thing for a man who is becoming a woman, who is dating a woman who dresses as a man. Using pronouns has been very hard recently. I believe both are shes' though.

But yes, asking the person which pronoun to use is always a good idea.

>> No.10795   [Delete]   [Edit]
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It hasn't been mentioned, but the term "trap" comes from the early days of 4Chan's /b/. Someone would post part of a photo of a trannie (or Bridget) and say something like "would you hit it?" or might even say nothing at all and wait for the "I'd hit it"s to roll in. Then they'd post all of the photo including the penis. After awhile, people caught wind of this and started posting "It's a trap!" (picture related) if they had suspicions it was.

I dunno if anyone would object to it or not. I suppose some might because of the source and the slight pejorative nature of it's origin. These days though it seems pretty accepted and I've seen a lot of crossdressers and pre-ops use it on the chans.

>> No.10798   [Delete]   [Edit]
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I'm fine with being called a crossdresser or trap. Calling me transgender isn't accurate in my case, I'm not a woman in a man's body, I'm a young man who enjoys dressing and acting like a woman.

From the transgendered people I've seen online they'll generally accept a lot of labels, because there a lot of words to describe them. They'll only have reason to be annoyed with you if they tell you to stop calling them something which insults or hurts them and you don't.

I hope that helps.

>> No.10835   [Delete]   [Edit]

When I dress up, I refer to myself as a trap quite often... Doesn't really hold any real negative connotations for me. I prefer not to be called anything with "trans" in it though, since I'm not really on any sort of path towards a sex change, I just think of myself as androgyne for the most part. All the trans words seem to imply a dissatisfaction with your current equipment, which isn't really the case for me.

>> No.16850   [Delete]   [Edit]

I'm in with tons of transgender people since I am myself, and calling someone in real life a 'trap' would be pretty rude, and yeah, 'transphobic' (gasp!).
It's okay to refer as trap if they identify that way (i.e refer to themselves as a trap.)
Like, I'm a reverse trap since that makes it easy for you to understand, but if you called me that in real life I'd be unhappy/kick you in the nuts.
I'm just a cute boy with problems, really.

>> No.16871   [Delete]   [Edit]
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This is quite possibly the clearest answer to the many debates that pop up on this board regarding the subject.

So I'm no expert on terminology, but it's looking to me like fetishists have no problem with being called a trap (or similar terms, to a degree), and those born into the wrong gender would rather be referred to by their identity's pronoun. (i.e. girl born in guy's body = refer to as "she")

Normally I like to pick on people who're touchy about labels, but in cases such as this they should be respected. Transgenders (or whatever term is appropriate, still not sure on what the blanket term is) are misunderstood and persecuted enough to afford to be as touchy as they want to be, I think.

>> No.43642   [Delete]   [Edit]

I am going to post here since it is slightly related...considering it is about the gender identity.

what do people prefer?

-Traps which identify as male (Hideyoshi)
-Traps which identify as female (Jun)
-Trap with no concept of gender (Mei no Naisho, Secret Devil-chan are two.)

I seem to find stories with either male identified traps or ones with no concept better.

>> No.43644   [Delete]   [Edit]


Personal bias forces me to take the side of the female-identifying traps. Sara Nikotama is an awesome example.

>> No.43645   [Delete]   [Edit]

I prefer those that identify as male, also because of personal bias.

>> No.44314   [Delete]   [Edit]


I'd go for any one of those three, but since I'm a faggot for cocks, female-identified traps might chop it off in the future, right? I'd go for the other ones then... maybe. I'm not sure.

Besides, women are crazy, I've seen post-op transwomen being just as nuts as their genetic female counterparts (because of hormones?)

In the end though, I admire traps regardless of their intentions, they're all beautiful. Sexually speaking I'd like them to keep the cock, but romantically I don't care, they can do whatever they want

>> No.44321   [Delete]   [Edit]
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>female-identified traps might chop it off in the future, right?

Er...SRS doesn't exactly work like that. The penis needs to remain intact, as the doc needs it to make the vagina. I won't go into detail, though; I don't wanna squick anybody out TOO bad.

Of course, there are no doubt some traps who lose their minds due to their hatred of their penis and chop it off, but, well...there would be a lot of blood. A LOT. That's why I didn't do it. 'Sides, it would be more effective to chop off the scrotum and take the testicles with it, for they're the parts that actually are responsible for producing testosterone and thus causing male puberty. There'd probably be a lot of blood with that ordeal too, which is again why I didn't do it. I can't even handle needles.

Pic unrelated but adorable.

>> No.44326   [Delete]   [Edit]
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>chop off the scrotum and take the testicles with it

But if you chop it off (or even just do the non inguinal surgery) you won't have any conveniently innervated skin to use for the labia...

>> No.44334   [Delete]   [Edit]


I know a guy who chopped his testicles off to make himself stop wearing dresses. Apparently he did it because if he got caught in a dress his family would literally kill him because they really were that redneck.

>> No.44340   [Delete]   [Edit]


I kind of meant it figuratively, I know that SRS doesn't work like that :P
But the story of that guy seems interesting/sad. Couldn't he move out or what? That really, really sucks.

>> No.44372   [Delete]   [Edit]

Meh, I tried to read the whole topic, but stopped about 2/3 of the end...

Thing is, traps isn't a good word for some of the sucessful pretty crossdressers. Unless they are veeery... let's say... naughty, they might get offended easily, and most of the ones that just do it because they think it's right / feel better doing it / don't do it on purpose are the ones that will get offended the most~

So, what would be a "good" word to describe the pretty crossdressers?
Pro-cross? nah, sounds too religious ¬¬ never a good thing.
he-girl? ... I feel like I'm into Eternia when I write this =_=

It would either be a combination, or a new word...

Anyone wondering if a new one should be done? I could call the best traps "Aprodite" or "Nymph", if either of them wouldn't sound pejorative or bad somehow <_<

>> No.44373   [Delete]   [Edit]

Chopping of your penis is potentially lethal, you might faint from the pain and bleed to death.

Chopping of your balls will result in you have a very hard time walking. 'at least if you do it wrong.

>> No.44376   [Delete]   [Edit]


>Besides, women are crazy, I've seen post-op transwomen being just as nuts as their genetic female counterparts (because of hormones?)

I've seen this too. It's sad to be honest.
Having grown up as a guy before transitioning into a woman, even if you didn't quite fit in or feel right about it, should really help give you a wider perspective and make it easier to see things from other people's point of view. Especially in matters regarding the differences between the genders.

>> No.44379   [Delete]   [Edit]

Pro-tip. Call them by their name. You'll get laid more often. Works on women too.

>> No.44395   [Delete]   [Edit]


Androgynous brain in a female body = win

Seeing things both ways is best indeed, remove the worst elements of both genders but keep the best of both!

I like you already.

>> No.44399   [Delete]   [Edit]


>> No.44417   [Delete]   [Edit]


Well, at least we have a word to describe you: "faggot"

>> No.44418   [Delete]   [Edit]


An unprovoked, distasteful personal attack. Keep that up, and we'll have a word to describe you, too: "banned".

>> No.44566   [Delete]   [Edit]


You should read more into established LGBT related stuff

and then realise that labels suck.

>> No.44567   [Delete]   [Edit]


>realise that labels suck


Edit: although I'm sure you quoted the wrong person there.

Last edited 11/01/24(Mon)11:02.

>> No.44635   [Delete]   [Edit]
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That made me happier than it should have, considering it's someone I have no idea who they are agreeing with me on an anonymous image board where noone knows who I am.
Thank you.

>> No.47510   [Delete]   [Edit]

As a transman, your friend is right. I do not like being called a reverse trap. I am pre-T.

Trap is slang for someone who can pass for the other gender, transgender is publically correct.

>> No.47511   [Delete]   [Edit]

Same transdude. transgendered people prefer to be called their gender, how they feel. They become extremely depressed over being called their biological gender. We can be gay, straight, bisexual, etc. A transguy who likes guys is gay, a transwoman who likes women is a lesbian, etc etc.

>> No.47513   [Delete]   [Edit]

My opinion is that the word "trap" is descriptive of a person who is biologically one gender but mistaken for another, whether it be intentional or not. For somebody to be effectively "trapped" they need to be physically interested to the point that it becomes a shocking revelation. There are sexual connotations to the term, for better or worse...

Using the word to describe a model or fictional character is always fine, but its incredibly muddy when considering the emotional turmoil that transgendered people typically go through. I personally don't mind being referred to as a trap since I value what I am, warts and all. I just feel bewildered that some people using the word might miss the fact that other transpeople are psychologically wired to the opposite of their biological sex and might not take it that well.

Socially, I actually view the word and the niche subcultures developing or expanding around it to be contributing rather effectively to the dissolving sexual barriers in our generation. I think its affectionate in an oddly charming if not slightly misguided sort of way (more or less just on the anime side since its easy to forget the 3DPD normies :p).

My only problem as an IRL trap is the term "reverse trap" which becomes as offensive, segregating and oxymoronic as the term "reverse rape"

>> No.48267   [Delete]   [Edit]

i just wish i could find a femboy who would be interested in playing with me so i can find out if my interest in traps can go to 3D or has to stay to 2D

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